Morning Summary, 10/18/11

A quickie post. I don't have a lot of time this morning, so this is just to inform anybody that posting will be light today.

I am thinking over the lunar rocket proposition. It may turn out to be an interesting proposition.

Update:

Here's what I've figured out so far:

some material obtained from wikipedia- thrust weight ratios and definition of watt

 Hopefully, the above is readable.  I put together sources from a couple web pages.  I wanted it all in one spot, so it can be seen together.  I've been working a bit on the delta v's, so this is not complete.

Update:
Here's some more calculations on a spreadsheet

Update:

If there's a problem here, it may well be that there isn't any such thing as a klystron or what have you that is capable of doing what I am describing. If there is, I'm not finding it on the web. Maybe I'm not looking in the right places.  Gyrotrons and Magnetrons too.  The stuff may be out there, but may not be suitable for this type of application.  This may work, but the mass is more than I expected.  Also, I'm not sure about the power output.

It also may be restricted technology because of its military potential.

I found such topics as induction heating, but this doesn't work for this type of purpose.

Also, I came across something I hadn't seen before: Magnetic field oscillating amplified thruster. However, the ISPs are not what I'm looking for, at least not in that range. Plus the thrust is too low.  Here's another interesting page, but not practically useful.  Also, this.

Overall, the idea may be feasible, but it would have to be some sort of government project.  I would suspect that the government wouldn't want people to fool around too much with this type of technology.

Update:

Compare some of the numbers with the Lunar Excursion Module, which landed 12 men on the moon and brought them back safely.  You can bump that up to 15 men, because of Apollo 13.  If the lunar excursion module wasn't available to the Apollo 13 astronauts, they wouldn't have made it back safely.

Looks like less power on the ascent stage than what I allowed for

Update:
It doesn't say that in this source, but it does in this.  There may be nitrogen on the moon.  If so, you don't need anything else in order to make rocket fuel, such as the hydrazine used on the lunar module on the Apollo moon missions.

Or you could crack water into hydrogen and oxygen and burn it.  But hydrazine may be more easily stored and makes for a simpler engine.

Update: 10/20/2011

I found a likely error by comparing my work with the actual lunar lander numbers, which I obtained here. Also, my numbers were using kgs as opposed to pounds.  The lunar lander ascent stage only weighed 10,000 pounds.   I was allowing for 10,000 kg, and 1 kg equals 2.2 pounds.  This wasn't the error, it was just a coincidence that the numbers were familiar.